133 thoughts on “Fundy Tweet of the Week: Whosoever Shall Add to the Words of This Book”

    1. Anyone think that maybe the church is trying to tell those of us that don’t want a contemporary service that it is “traditional?” That they are not SBC and that they use the kjv so you can choose the place that would best fit you. Hmmm?

      1. Or…
        That they are cultish in practice and have consigned themselves to the dustbin of religious irrelevancy?

        and..
        They practice Bibliolatry?

        2. Don, based upon your potty mouth in times past of all the people on here that might try and comment you have the least of any voice but I am sure that in your world you are probably a real “loud mouth!”

        3. Mote and Beam,

          No point in getting personal with Don. I don’t think he was personally attacking you, he was merely expressing what has been expressed a thousand time on this sight by hundreds of people regarding the same dead horse these KJVO people beat.

          That is all.

        5. Not me… I may be sneaky, but that kind of “bitterness”, even faked, would guilt me into not getting a good night’s rest.
          Unless you meant John Hamblin

        6. Actually I was referring to “he who shall not be named.” There is some SFL history with that John.

        7. St. John the Revelator?
          John the Apostate?
          John the Testicular?

          You have piqued my interest. This poster looks like Jim Beam the Preposterous

        9. Please please use caution reading through the comments on those posts, or any post that “he who shall not be named” was commenting on.

        12. I really hated John. He reminded me of my ex…kept purposefully baiting you and wouldn’t shut up.

      2. Mote and Beam – Please describe what a “traditional” service consists of please. And where in the Bible it is spelled out?
        Also, what verse in the Bible tells us what “old-fashioned” means?

        1. There are many, many traditions of worship in Christianity. Even the “Contemporary” services have a tradition, since some churches have been doing them since the 1960s, if not longer (I have knowledge of them from the 60s on). So it means nothing to say you are “traditional” unless you specify the tradition or traditions you are following, and it means nothing to say “old-fashioned” unless you indicate which fashions from what period you embrace.

        2. Scorpio, please don’t be snarky with me. YOu and I both know exactly what they mean when the say, “Old fashioned or traditional.” Just like you know exactly what it means when they advertise that they are contemporary. Just as many of the churches that many of the people on this site now attend that has an early “Traditional service” and a later “Contemporary.” You and I both know that means the early service is going to be traditional hymns mostly attended by seniors and Middle aged conservative families. The second service will be CCRM/P&W/very emotion based music with the emphasis of satisfying a younger crowd. Which, in answer to your question, is exactly the opposite of what God command Jeremiah to tell the people in the sixth chapter of his writing. If you look at 16 Jeremiah writes, “Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein. I don’t know seems like God was telling Israel you have left the ways of your Fathers. I know, I know, this is where you argue that is OT, we are not under law but under grace, we have liberty. I get all that but you asked for chapter and verse concerning keeping with the old way. Another interesting passage is 1 Kings 21 and the prophets that said, “Go up King but Micaiah said different.” These prophets of the culture were living in peace giving the people and the king exactly what they wanted but God wasn’t anywhere near it. I want to be in a place where the Lord Jesus Christ is honored and glorified every time we meet. No bitterness, not wrath, no vengence but God’s people meeting for the purpose of Him being glorified. Knowing that the man standing in the pulpit is just like me; flesh and bones.

        3. Scorpio, I see what you’re saying, but to be fair to the IFB guys, many Christians of other denominations use the words “traditional” and “contemporary” to describe their worship services.

          Some churches have a “traditional” service in the early morning on Sunday, and than a “contemporary” service later.

          I grew up as a Southern Baptist. Mom and Dad used to take the siblings and me to church weekly when I was a kid. Back then, there were no monitors or big video screens in churches.

          We had a choir of people and an old lady on a piano. Some churches today are still pretty much like that.

          But today, some churches (especially the seeker friendly, mega, large non demon churches – which I think I loathe as much as legalistic churches like IFB), have guitar players on stage, drum kits, laser shows during Sunday morning services, a preacher with goatee and wearing flip flops and skinny jeans.

          The Bible does not forbid any of that, true, but personally, I think it’s cheesy and stupid and going over board with pandering to people with the loud rock bands, big video monitors, concert like lighting, etc.

          It makes church more of a rock concert circus environment than believers joining to worship God and meet with each other for spiritual purposes.

        4. “demon” should be “deNOM,” as in non denominational.

          I was trying to avoid having to type that big word out in the first place. sigh.

        5. M&B, that was actually a fairly weak attempt at proof-texting. I could do a lot better than that. But, I post here to remind you that the praise and worship crowd has plenty of proof texts of their own. Could you please address the following passages for me? (And before you start attacking me, I attend one of the most traditional church services in town with hymns, a pipe organ, a choir, and a liturgy.)

          Ps. 40:3 “He hath put a NEW SONG in my mouth.”

          Eph. 5:19 “Speaking to yourselves in psalms and hymns and SPIRITUAL SONGS.” (Interesting to note that hymns-only churches seem to violate this command pretty clearly.)

          Ps. 150:4-5 “Praise him with timbrel and DANCE: praise him with stringed instruments and organs. Praise him upon the LOUD CYMBALS: praise him upon the high-sounding cymbals.”

          I could go on, but I think I’ve raised more proof-texts than you did so I’ll stop.

        6. M&B: You said: “Which, in answer to your question, is exactly the opposite of what God command Jeremiah to tell the people in the sixth chapter of his writing. If you look at 16 Jeremiah writes, “Thus saith the LORD, Stand ye in the ways, and see, and ask for the old paths, where is the good way, and walk therein, and ye shall find rest for your souls. But they said, We will not walk therein. I don’t know seems like God was telling Israel you have left the ways of your Fathers.”
          Here are the specifics God gives about the old paths: “For from the least of them even unto the greatest of them every one is given to covetousness; and from the prophet even unto the priest every one dealeth falsely. They have healed also the hurt of the daughter of my people slightly, saying, Peace, peace; when there is no peace. Were they ashamed when they had committed abomination? nay,”

          How does this at all relate to modern American Christianity? Israel left the ways of righteousness (humility, honesty, integrity, loving their neighbors, etc.) These character traits, along with not worshiping false gods (REAL false god with actual names and statues and religious worship designed to satisfy the gods’ desires), were the old paths.

          As for application, you can apply it to modern American Christians being sinful-hypocritical, adulterous, materialistic, unconcerned for the poor and needy, thoughtless, lazy, etc. If someone started bringing in chanting to Krishna and Jesus into the church you can make case against that (no Kirtans in the kirk!).

          But you cannot (and no one can) use the Old Paths as a way of manipulating people to use a certain translation/music form/liturgy-non-liturgy. It doesn’t fit. EVER.

          You can’t say that the new translations are the same as worshipping other gods UNLESS you say that the KJV is God.

          So what if we don’t worship the way our fathers did? Our fathers didn’t worship the way the Israelites did. The Church of England/Catholics/Baptist: they aren’t Israelites! Jeremiah is talking to Israelites! Plus, in context, the chapter isn’t even speaking about worship styles/translations/etc.

          And you can’t blanket say, New ways are bad because the old ways are GOOD thus new is bad. You have to clearly show precisely how the old is good inherently for all times, and how the new is bad inherently for all times without appealing to novelty or antiquity.

          Can you do that?

        7. Honestly when I attend a contemporary service at my church, its serious, intellectual, scripture based lyrics and that drives the emotion of the worshippers because they are being called to remember who God is and what he has done.

          When I used to attend a “traditional, old-fashioned” service at the local IFB it was early 1900’s gospel songs with little scripture in the lyrics, lots of schmaltz and excessive amounts of emotion driven by the feelings of old-fashionedness, not at all connected to worship of God but instead worship of a human culture that is at best a dim reflection of God and at worst completely disconnected from Him.

          your completely inaccurate portrayal about what that means destroys your credibility.

        8. Amy,

          Good response to M&B. You’re spot on when you point out that his seeming attempt to offer Jeremiah 6:16 as proof that “traditional” worship style” is more pleasing to God than
          “contemporary” worship style is a misapplication of scripture. Jeremiah began his ministry in the thirteenth year of King Josiah’s reign. Based on the way M&B used the text, maybe we could argue that any style of dress or music originating after about 626 B.C. is worldly.

          Still, we should give Pastor Shirley credit for truth in advertising when it comes to putting “Old-Fashioned” on the sign since we all pretty well know what it means and it lets the visitor know what to expect.

      3. While yes it serves to let everyone know just what to expect in the church service, the message it also sends out is that the only truly redeemed people are those who are old fashioned, KJV, independent, fundamentalists.

        We hear their message loud and clear. I wonder why you are so offended that we are all hearing that message.

        1. Leanne, with all respect, I am not offended at all but rather amazed. Amazed that you having never been to this church already know exactly what type of people go there. I appreciate that fact that the church has this on their sign because it lets me know that I don’t have to worry that I am going to have to either sit through a something I disagree with or walkout. I have been to IFB churches that didn’t state who they truly are and it was very uncomfortable for me. I travel full-time and I have to find a church most every week and a traditional service is what I want. Pastor Shirley is telling people like me this is what you can expect and for Darrell to exploit that is sin. For you to assume you know their intentions and their heart is sin as well and because of that you have become what you claim not to be.

        2. Mote and Beam:

          “Leanne, with all respect, I am not offended at all but rather amazed. Amazed that you having never been to this church already know exactly what type of people go there.”

          Well, first, I don’t believe Leanne was expressing knowledge about the people that go there.

          “I appreciate that fact that the church has this on their sign because it lets me know that I don’t have to worry that I am going to have to either sit through a something I disagree with or walkout.”

          That, dear Mote and Beam, is exactily what Leanne was alluding to. The sign says it all for those of us who have endured the IFB nonsense for many years. The thousands of comments on this site have referenced the many areas of abuse.

          “I have been to IFB churches that didn’t state who they truly are and it was very uncomfortable for me.”

          Really? Many IFB churches that didn’t state who they were? What do you mean by that?

          “I travel full-time and I have to find a church most every week and a traditional service is what I want.”

          Congratulations. But not evereyone wants what you want. Also, just because you want something doesn’t make it all-inclusive.

          “Pastor Shirley is telling people like me this is what you can expect and for Darrell to exploit that is sin.”

          So, you’re God? If Darrell has sinned, then it’s up to him to repent, not you to repent for him. Also, how is he exploiting this church by posting their own public sign. We are free to disagree, aren’t we?

          “For you to assume you know their intentions and their heart is sin as well and because of that you have become what you claim not to be.”

          Here you go again, Mote, pronouncing guilt upon another. I don’t see where Leanne is judging anyone’s intention. The sign is what it is and when someone knowns the background and has experienced the cult-like practices first hand, they speak out.

          B.R.O.

        3. The “traditional” worship style being referenced in these comments is that of the late-19th to mid-20th century in white, Anglophone American Protestant churches. Christianity is 2000 years old, not 100 or 150 years old, and is worldwide, not limited to one country or culture. So, again, you should specify which traditions you mean if you say you’re “traditional.” Everybody is following some kind of tradition. Even improvisational theater and free jazz have their traditions.

      4. M&B–

        You obviously didn’t read Darrell’s comment if you think that the sign is the problem. It’s not.

        The tweet is the problem. Here’s a preacher who would likely rain down fire and brimstone on someone who added to the Bible. In his mind, it’s sin, yet here he is guilty of doing so himself.

        Maybe you should look up the verse you’re referring to in your chosen penname before you judge Darrell here.

      5. I realize that I’m a day late to the discussion, but work happens. Anyway, I get a chuckle out of a group with its roots in the 20th century calling itself “old fashioned.”

      6. Bless your heart, honeybunch.

        It could very well be that the guy in charge is guilty of hubris. We know he’s guilty of ignorance.

    2. Anyone think that maybe the church is trying to tell those of us that don’t want a contemporary service that it is “traditional?” That they are not SBC and that they use the kjv so you can choose the place that would best fit you. Hmmm?

    3. Maybe if everyone lets this guy get a ‘first’, he’ll be happy and go away for a few weeks.

    1. Much like the white piano, the butt cushion must be taken on faith. Only those of us with True Discernment have our buns comfortably ensconced in its cushy depths. Oh, the joy. I only wish I could bring you into the butt cushion fold….come home, son.

      I’ll pray for you.

        1. Didn’t mean to muscle in on your turf; I just couldn’t resist. I can’t wait till he earns his fundy doctorate.

        1. Looks like Tony and I graduated from the same academy.:roll: That would be “incompetence”.

  8. I am sure he doesn’t see it as adding to the Scripture because “old fashioned, fundamental, independent, KJV” is a synonym for “redeemed.”

    1. There seems to be this fettish with “the good ‘ol days” with fundamentalists. What does “old fashioned” even mean? So you drive a ’55 Chevy, wear blue suede shoes, and roll you candy cigs in the sleeve of your white t-shirt.

      What does this even mean? Is it holding to the traditions of your grand parents in the early part of the 20th century?

      How about the motto, “We take the words of the Lord Jesus Christ serious,” or, “We gather here to build-up the brethern,” or, “Celebrating the grace of our Saviour.”

      I don’t know, just some thoughts.

      1. It’s a ’57 Studebaker Silver Hawk with 2-tone paint in SeaMist Green & Arctic White, not a ’57 Chevy. (Dream car…*le sigh*)

        The Chevy is too mainstream & worldly. 🙄

        2. Sounds like the car my grandfather drove. He took the Studebaker and dropped a 12 cylinder racing engine and heavied-up brakes in it, and then cruised around town, challenging the ducktails and their 57 Chevies to drag. Not only did he never lose, he never got a speeding ticket or a warning, because he did all the work on the police cars. My Mother never got over the fact that he wouldn’t let her drive it. Of course she did roll her brother’s car, so….

          I like Studebakers. YMMV.

      2. exactly. The “godly culture” the fundamentalists hold up as ideal really is only a 1950 American culture. It has nothing to do with the culture from the days in which Scripture was actually written.
        But that seems to be how humans work. The Amish and Mennonites chose to create a culture based on 17th-18th century. For some reason we are prone to define the idealistic past culture as the best expression of biblical faith rather than wrestling with what does faith look like expressed in the culture we are in.

        And I agree on the “we take the Lord seriously.” To me it is a means to stop any dialogue or conversation from happening. When they say they take the Lord seriously or the Bible seriously or hold the Bible in high regard, they simply close the door to discuss anything in depth. Its one of the walls they hold up so their faith is not challenged.

        1. “For some reason we are prone to define the idealistic past culture as the best expression of biblical faith rather than wrestling with what does faith look like expressed in the culture we are in.”

          Very well put.

          I guess it’s easier to pick a culture from the past and hold it up as our standard than to figure out how we should express our faith today. Arbitrary rules erase uncertainty… and kind of make “walking by faith” inessential.

  9. First, let me say this is the closest I have ever been to first, and second, this grammar is making me angry. Usually I don’t even care, but it sounds like the “KJV” is saying so. Same thing with their sign.

    He is focusing way too hard on the people’s exteranal works rather than the internal that God “gives” to them. To me, the sign should read (though probably not for them seeing as they are IFB): loving, joyful, peaceful, good, self-controlled. It would make for a much better church (in my opinion).

    1. You’re right. Pastor Shirley’s syntax really grates.

      Discussion topic: Is Tony Shirley related to SFL’s infamous Capslock Shirley?

        1. Tony?? I thought Shirley was Carmine’s girl? No wait, Shirley married an army medic by the name of Walter Meany. That made her Shirley Feeney-Meany. I guess her military marriage didn’t work out so, what, d’she do go back to Milwaukee and hook up with Tony?

  10. The KJV is the truly inspired preservation of scripture more so than the original, ancient scrolls and manuscripts; my pastor and Bill Grady said so…

  12. John 5:38-40
    His voice you have never heard, his form you have never seen, and you do not have his word abiding in you, for you do not believe the one whom he has sent. You search the Scriptures because you think that in them you have eternal life; and it is they that bear witness about me, yet you refuse to come to me that you may have life.

    They worship the King James Translation more than the one whom it reveals. That, is idolatry.

    1. Thank you Don ❗ ❗

      Question: Do you believe that the IFB is ignorant or their blantant idolatr or do you belief their constant restating of their idolatry is their way of passively saying, “Yes we know we worshipping a translation and we’re not ashamed to say so”?

      1. It’s a sliding scale but on the whole I truly believe that those in the KJVO movement are ignorant of their idolatry. That doesn’t excuse their idolatry but I think in their prideful anti-intellectualism and Acts 4:13a way of thinking they cannot see it for what it is. That coupled with their idea that the “Word of God” means the written word rather than the Living word, Jesus Christ. That is where the lion’s share of the error comes from. They believe that the revealed written word is deity, thus it is the fourth member of the trinity. Some even believe that Jesus Christ is the written word and some believe that the Holy Spirit is the written word. However they slice it, it’s idolatry.

        1. I have actually heard some fundamentalist pastors declare that if you want to see your God, here he is…as they lift up the KJV bible. They make no distinction between the different meanings of the term “the Word” in Scripture.

    2. Yes, I seem to recall that manna gets worms in it and stinks if you keep it from one day to the next.

      1. Well you’re not as bad as me. I thought it said New Mama Baptist Church when I first saw it. They do have a way of naming churches after obscure Bible references that only people who go to church would know.

    1. True that. Most of ’em fool you into thinking you’re at the depot ready to board the Gospel Train. Once you realize you’re riding the short bus to Alternate Reality Village, it’s too late. 😕

  16. I feel a tad bit sorry for old Shirley. @tonyshirley1611 is about to get lit up. Anyone want to place odds on when he’ll: a) tweet defensively & claim persecution, B) thank someone for their support during this difficult time, c) suspend his Twitter account “indefinitely”?

    1. Ah, but we know from reading John Hamblin’s piece yesterday that being persecuted, or even disagreed with, proves that you’re God’s annointed.

      1. Well, my old IFB pastor really disagreed with me on child protection issues, I guess that must mean I’m anointed, right? 😈

  19. This is Caleb Shirley ‘ uncle from last week’s FTOTW. And New Manna was named by Danny Castle.

  22. I will start by saying that I disagree with a lot of tings Tony does, but he is a good man. He was a real friend to me when I was a young man. No, I wouldn’t attend his church, which has several hundred members, but I won’t make fun of him either.

  23. *whimpers*
    That church is in my old hometown.
    I am well-aquatinted with their brand of fundy-crazy.

    (Different pastor though. The one who was there when we went a few times was ousted for an affair with a much younger woman.)

  24. As a pastor, one thing I have never understood is why pastors feel the need to have their name appear on any church signage. While it may not be their intention, it suggests a kind of cult of personality. In fact Paul seems to address this issue in 1 Corinthians 1:12; what is most important isn’t following any particular teacher/preacher, but following Christ. I will step down from my soapbox now, lol.

    2. I have always wondered the same thing!!! Brother Burt Blowhard, Pastor. Ummmm…who cares?

    3. I agree. One of the worst I’ve seen locally is Northwest Bible Baptist Church (Elgin, IL), with the pastor’s name plastered on every church brochure, on the side of every bus and van, you name it. It reeks of pompousness, and is worse yet because he uses the “Dr” title that most certainly isn’t earned.

      1. I’m in Elgin for 3 days every August for a conference. I’ll have to keep my eyes open for the MOG from Northwest Bible Baptist Church while I’m there. I’m certain I will be blessed and inspired by seeing HIS name :^)

  25. And he was using Twitter to announce this? Is Twitter really ‘old fashioned?’

    Don’t most IFBs, like some other quarters of conservative Christianity, tend to define “old fashioned” as being anything prior to 1960?

    Was Twitter around prior to 1960? Because I don’t think it was. I don’t think it was even around before 2005.

  26. I don’t know, but it seems to me that this type of signage is a great kindness bestowed upon church-goers. If a church has “Old-Fashioned, Independent, Fundamental, KJV” advertised on their sign, you can be sure what to expect before you waste your time entering the door.

  27. ❗ ATTN DARRELL: ❗

    Is the preacher in this video IFB (Steven L. Anderson)?

    ➡ Nicolas Cage in new Left Behind movie

    He’s not happy that Nic Cage is in the Left Behind film. He doesn’t like people who work in “Helly wood”.

    Carpenters, landscapers, plumbers are A-OK in his book, though.

    He doesn’t care for Capt Kirk, Picard, Tom Cruise, Spongebob Squarepants, Justin Bieber, and a billion others.

    He said he might “cross the street to kick Justin Bieber’s little… and then the video trails off.

    I’m not into celebrity worship either, but this preacher is really overstating his point, IMO.

    Per his opinion on Nic Cage. Some of Cage’s movies were less than stellar, but he has a few I enjoyed.

    1. I believe that is the wall-pisser himself.
      That video clip is so good it really has to be a whole SFL entry in the future, so I won’t comment on it further right now.
      Except … Does he really think SpongeBob Squarepants is a real person?

      1. I agree. This is an entire SFL topic. I do love the pole next to the pulpit. He may break out in a spontaneous pole dance.

    2. 😯 For a group of people supposedly so concerned for everyone’s souls, apparently the souls of celebrities don’t matter.

      1. My thoughts exactly. I wouldn’t walk across the street to talk to them–seems to be in direct conflict with their soul winning mantra.

  28. Old fashion religion. Guess what, 3 piece suits did not exist in Biblical times, nor did organs. Come to think of it neither did the KJV Bible. Old fashion religion, should we go back to the 1950’s, Middle Ages when they spoke a different type of English language? 36 AD? 2000 BC? Should we wear sandals and robes? Meet in caves?

    1. You said, Old fashion religion. Guess what, 3 piece suits did not exist in Biblical times, nor did organs. Come to think of it neither did the KJV Bible.

      Neither did Twitter, which the guy was using to spread the message 😆

  29. Ah, the classic old versus new topic. Despite my advanced age (70s), I’m reluctant to criticize modern worship styles. I will say this. Participation by the congregation for some portion of the service is important to me. (This usually involves singing hymns, but can include other portions.) When the selection of hymns have a half-life so short that they are gone before we learn to sing them, or when the words are displayed only on screens which can’t be read when you tire of standing, then I would say that church no longer respects its senior citizens.

  30. New Manna Baptist Church – because whatever you take with you and don’t use will stink by tomorrow.

    The tweet is a bit elitist, but that’s not too unusual. I didn’t think of it as adding to Scripture; he’s merely using a fairly well-known phrase from Scripture and making a change; he doesn’t claim that his change is Scripture.

  31. Gimme that old-time religion,
    Gimme that old-time religion,
    Gimme that old-time religion,
    It’s good enough for me.

    It was good for Ignatius of Antioch,
    It was good for Justin Martyr,
    It was good for Irenaeus,
    And it’s good enough for me.

    it was good for Saint John Chrysostom,
    It was good for Athanasius,
    It was good for Saint Augustine,
    And it’s good enough for me.

    Oh wait…all those folks lived way before the KJV. And way before the invention of pianos. And way, way, waaaay before the 1950s.

    Ooops.

    2. Perhaps a more accurate version would be:
      give us that old time religion (but nothing before 1611)
      give us that old time religion (and nothing that looks catholic)
      give us that old time religion (and they need to have the right view of Creation and the end times)
      It’s good enough for me.

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