It’s been a while since we saw anything from David Grice so here we go…
The combination of false statements and circular reasoning is just astounding.
“We know that Jesus made fresh grape juice because that’s what we use in the Lord’s Supper and we use it in the Lord’s supper because…that’s what Jesus made?” QED.
It goes down like this–after being called out for his falsehood that Jesus was a Nazarite and therefore never drank (He was a Nazarene) my fundy supervisor starts to explain how the Greek text was not meant for us, it was meant for the gentile (I didn’t even know where to begin on that piece of KJV worship) and that the wine in the bible was “New Wine” which is grape juice. Of course you can’t get that translation without going to the Greek, and the word that translates as New Wine can also be translated to mean an alcoholic beverage, and in Acts someone describes the apostles as being drunk on “New Wine” (but that is in the ESV so I suppose he wouldn’t accept that argument) but yeah, cool man, love the solid argument. Try to find the phrase “New Wine” in the KJV outside of “You don’t put new wine into old wine skins” I couldn’t.
Which is King James Onlyism when pressed – the original text does not matter, it is the King James Bible that is infallible, and one can throw the Hebrew and Greek under the bus. All the talk about the Hebrew and the Greek is just a smokescreen, adopted when it is useful, but their standard is the 1769 Blayney revision of the King James.
New Wine is also found in the KJV in Acts 2:13, in the context of an accusation of drunkenness. So much for it being non-alcoholic, then.
Thanks Basil–more recently he quizzed me about which translation I will preach from when I leave the military for the pastorate next month since he knows I enjoy the parallel study of several translations, KJV included. I managed to avoid a fight, but it caused me to write briefly on the topic on my own blog…but is it shameful to promote myself here?
There may be a lot of good reasons to refrain from drinking alcoholic beverages. But using the Bible as the basis for that belief is not one of them. A careful reading of the wedding feast in which those present say that the best wine is served first, and then when everyone is drunk, it’s time to break out the rot gut stuff is sufficient proof.
But I often wonder why those obese preachers do not devote equal time to those who “sitteth long at the all you can eat resteraunt.
Dear Sister of mine, I think you need to repent of your rebellious spirit and stop questioning the divine authority of the country-fried steak. The Lord gave us fried chicken and mashed potatoes for a reason, and you know that Jesus himself probably had 3 whole plates of ambrosia salad while he was riding that dinosaur. Maybe you need to watch a little less CNN and a little more sloppily recorded sermons on sins that you’ve committed, even if you don’t know it.
PS, if the Bible isn’t sufficient for you, then you go on with your damnable ‘thinking’ and see where it leads you. 😡
Lulz
With all due respect, I am going to have to separate from you for failing to put gravy on the fried chicken and mashed potatoes.
All aboard the rofl-copter! 😆
I rather go to my favorite bar then a fundie church. If someone at my favorite bar tells me “to go to hell” they really don’t mean it.
Also, there are some non-white people at my bar. They are not told by the bartender that they should drink somewhere else.
-_- Texas, I am disappoint.
No attempt to even MENTION the Greek text which, although I don’t know Greek and haven’t read an analysis of this passage, I have a sneaking suspicion contains words that mean “to get hammered”. They follow the Old Paths, alright, but not THAT old. I would raise my Jack and Coke in a toast, but it’s 3:47 pm, and that would be gross.
I was curious so I looked it up.
According to blueletterbible.org, the word is “methyo” which means “to be drunken.”*
In modern Greek (according to Google Translate at least), methyo means “methyl,” ie the chemical term for alcohol.
* It also can mean “metaph. of one who has shed blood or murdered profusely”, so if this guy refuses to believe Jesus was condoning alcohol consumption, his only alternate meaning is that Jesus was going to wait to bring out the good stuff until after the guests had committed vicious murder.
(At the risk of reusing the same saying in one thread)
Ladies and gentlemen, the ROFL copter is now boarding.
🙄 Yes!!! To all who think this guy needs a little alcohol! The Greek verb here means “to drink to intoxication.” I looked it up in my Strong’s Concordance, a fundi’s second favorite book.
How many people do you know who won’t drink a glass of wine to sooth their spirits at the end of a tough day but will quickly and gladly pop a Valium? Either way, their mood is altered (drunk?). The primary difference is that the prescription med is destroying your liver while the wine is reportedly good for you.
All things in moderation!
I told my father, who was educated as a Southern Baptist pastor, about Mr. Grices… interesting interpretation of this passage and he got a good laugh out of it. But then he actually took classes on ancient Greek and such, making him dangerously well educated and capable of independent thought. You know how dangerously liberal Southern Baptists are.
circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works because circular reasoning works …….