People, Public Life

Bogeymen

246 Comments

The lore of fundamentalism is rife with the terrifying specters of a thousand faceless enemies that threaten to destroy your life, wreck your home, pervert your children, and embarrass your pastor. These threatening figures come cloaked in all manner of cunning disguises. They look like your co-workers, your neighbors, and maybe even your own family members. They are the bogeymen of fundyland and the tales of their evil should keep you from ever straying too far from home.

There’s hardly a group that isn’t a card-carrying member this fearsome horde of evil. Why, if I stand upon the front porch of my house and gaze past our massive Scripture verse lawn signs, I can see the faces of the enemy all around me…

Look, right down there at the corner there’s the nice Catholic grandma who always waves hello to people and gives them cookie as she tries to send them to hell with her idolatry. Also I’m pretty sure that fruitcake she gives out at Christmas has alcohol in it. Every time she gives me one I hand her a tract about how wrong it is to worship Mary so hopefully I’m getting through…

And there is Miguel and his partner Jim. They always offer to cut my grass in the summer and shovel my walk in the winter time but I know that’s just their way of making me accept their filthy lifestyle that is going to be the ruination of our entire country. They do have a really nice lawn, though…

And then there’s that Nigerian family that just moved in on the other side of the street. The man said something about being an Anglican but I sure hope they’re not secretly bringing us any of that African voodoo. I’ll get my loudspeaker system and KJV Scourby tapes ready just in case we need to repel the darkness…

Well, I’d better get back inside now. One of the neighbors just started his car and I can hear it playing that terrible rap music nonsense. Better get inside and make sure the windows are closed so the kids aren’t exposed to it…

In fundyland a healthy dose of paranoia isn’t nearly enough. The bogeymen are everywhere.

246 thoughts on “Bogeymen”

    1. Hallelujah for deliverance too!

      This attitude described in the post keeps the IFB from treating people with love; instead they run away from them in fear – which is so unChristlike!

  5. oh oh. Double boogey. Liberal AND I listen to that horrible “rock music that according to our former pastor was going to send people to straight to hell.”
    I had a friend in high school whose parents were not totally fundy, but they did have some extreme views. I think in 1983 he lost every single AC/DC, Kiss, etc CD and tape he owned. 🙄

  7. . . . And then there’s the biggest bogeyman of all: President Obama. Quote that I heard with my own two ears from the pulpit of a fundy friend: “I’m not sure that Obama actually is the Antichrist, but he’s definitely opening all the doors for him, and it’s just a matter of time.”

    1. Yes, WP, and I am so old, I have heard that said about Henry Kissinger, Pope Paul VI and every successive pope, Jimmy Carter, Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton, Madelyn Albright… And the beat goes on. 🙄

      1. My favorite is Al Gore, Bill Clinton was just a puppet who was going to declare martial law in his last week in office. 🙄

    2. I don’t see that Obama quote as too far from the truth. Not sure what’s so controversial about it.

      1. Not controversial, just more of the same. It’s always “somebody” who is either the antichrist or opening the door for him. Obama is just the latest version. I can’t even remember all of the different people who were said to be…it gets ridiculous. We have been living in the “end times” since the 60’s, and probably before….

        1. Oh definitely before. There have been groups claiming the end times for the entire history of the U.S. I just did a course on American Religious History this summer…the Revolution marked the beginning of the end, then the Constitution did, then the war of 1812 and so on and so forth all the way to the present.

        2. Many Christians in both the US and England believed that Tolstoy was the antichrist. Of course, as has been pointed out, he was just one of many supposed antichrists.

      2. Wait….what? Yes, it’s controversial to claim that Obama is anything other than a duly elected politician, and no more good nor evil than any other of his ilk. The antichrist? 🙄

      3. “I don’t see that Obama quote as too far from the truth.”

        Oh, please.
        Bad president is one thing (if you think he is one); Antichrist is a completely other thing.

        But most of the criticisms I hear of Barack Obama are, in one way or another, objecting to the facts that (1) He is black; and (2) He seems foreign, because he has a funny name, and his father was Kenyan.

        My own view is that objecting to his policies is fair (if those objections are based on fact, instead of all the wild rumors I keep hearing people repeat), but objecting to his race and/or ancestry is just plain ignorant and bigoted.

      4. If my recollection is er, correct, the Antichrist is a man of peace. Wars in Afghanistan, Iraq and Libya do not make President Obama a man of peace.

        Seriously, he is more to the right than Dwight Eisenhower. Unless, of course, the Antichrist is a Republican.

        2. What I have never understood is why it seems to be accepted fact that the Antichrist will be an American president? Perhaps this speaks more about our tendency to ignore the rest of the world.

          If one really wanted to make this argument, former president Lula of Brazil makes more sense as the Antichrist than Obama.

  8. Contemporary Christian Music (CCM) is another one. We couldn’t learn about Jesus through music that had a beat.

  9. Definitely one of the best posts I’ve ever read on here Darrel. It is so true. Reminds me of what the Catholic church used to pound into their subjects during the Middle Ages. Kind of scary actually.

    1. Except my daughter’s 2nd grade teacher who freely admitted she was a Christian when I asked her in a private email. (She made some comments at meet the teacher night that made me want to ask…otherwise I would have NEVER asked her. She is a sweet lady and very good for my daughter!) 😉

  13. The ultimate fundy bogeyman is the neo-evangelical. To hear fundys talk he is out there with his NIV and his CCM PowerPoints seeking to devour every God-fearing fundy who dares to start down the slippery slope with him. Never mind the fact that the new evangelical movement died out at least 25 years ago, probably more like 30 or 35.
    Some of the more prescient fundys are going after the emergents or the “postmodernists,” whoever they are. The emerging church fad is already passed out of the evangelical mainstream, and I have yet to meet or read of anyone who calls himself a postmodernist.
    Then of course there is Elvis Presley. Find an old enough fundy, and he hates Elvis.

    1. Yeah. They’ll wait for another 10 or 15 years, when the everyone else agrees the emergent movement has fully died out, before they start railing against it.

    2. They should now love Elvis, because remember, Jack Hyles supposedly witnessed to Elvis in an elevator? 🙄

  14. “Bogeyman” or “Boogeyman”, which is it? I always think of an enemy fighter jet when I hear “Bogey” but not sure what a “bogeyman” is suppoed to be. :mrgreen:

      1. Lol I learn something new every day. 😎 So do you pronounce the “Bogeyman” with the “oo” sound when you spell it that way? 😉

        1. Yes but it’s more of a schwa sound than a long oo. 🙂

          There’s a handy IPA chart in the dictionary link

    2. Bogey, Boogey, Booger – all are synonyms for the devil.

      From O Brother Where Art Thou…
      Everett: Well, there are all manner of lesser imps and demons, Pete, but the great Satan hisself is red and scaly with a bifurcated tail, and he carries a hay fork.
      Tommy Johnson: Oh, no. No, sir. He’s white, as white as you folks, with empty eyes and a big hollow voice. He loves to travel around with a mean old hound. That’s right.

  15. Of course, not only is the KJV required as a defense, but Alexandar Scourby is the only acceptable voice for playing on loudspeakers (apart from the local MOG, of course.)

  16. I heard a story of a man who could not sleep in the same room as a blanket that had a strange symbol on it. He had to take it outside.

    Then there was the guy who went to see Fellowship of the Ring and could just ‘feel’ the evil coming from the screen. I guess it was because a Catholic wrote the source material.

    I admit I experienced the same ‘evil’ feeling whenever I listened to 80’s era fake metal hair bands. :mrgreen:

  18. I once remember sitting in a Sunday School class, and my teacher asking something in the matter of “Do you have to deal with [everyday] evil in your life?”

    I responded with “Yes, everyday in my job at the F.B.I. counterterrorism division”. He then clarified, about what he meant about “evil”, with the tone in his voice that was expected upon receiving a smart remark, and then he segued into some examples about his co-workers.

    I don’t remember his co-workers being especially devious. The same old canard of not meeting them for happy hour, and not swearing in public.

    His co-workers did say that they would take up his invitation to church, if he would meet them for drinks. His co-workers knew how to make this a no-deal.

    1. Hoo, boy.
      This is even better than “Democratic President = Antichrist.”
      “Co-workers who drink in bars and use curse words are worse than terrorists who set off bombs, kidnap, and kill people.”

  19. May I proclaim that I am now a proud card-carrying member of the Bogey Society.

    Seriously though, and people wonder why IFB is known as a cult. That’s textbook cult stuff.

    1. I think I am an Arch Master Bogey of the 666th degree.

      Liberal. check.

      University-educated. check.

      Dancer. check.

      Rock music listener. check.

      Doesn’t own a KJV. check.

      Owns a Jerusalem Bible. check.

      Goes to the movie house. check.

      Goes to the bar. check.

      Swears like a drunken trooper. check x 10.

      Votes for the New Democratic Party in Canada–the ones who first brought in universal health care. check x 648.

      Now I’m off to a local lodge meeting where we plan on putting more fluoride in the water to further our agenda.

      1. (wiping away tears) This has me STILL laughing so hard that I am actually holding my ribs. LOVE IT.

        4. EPIC WIN, and I owe it all to you! Just downloaded Candide to my Kindle, for FREE! Of course, it is in English, because unlike YOU, I am STILL precociously right with gid. 😈

        6. Oh, book freak, here, plus I skimmed it waaaay back in college, oh yes, at that bastion of fundamentalism, HAC. Now I intend to really digest it fully. Again, merci!

        8. No. I was at the really excellent Lake County Public Library, in Merrillville, IN, and skimmed it there. I knew better than to take it back to the dorm.

        10. IAHB, I am about the oldest chick on here, (oops, wait! Sims’ birthday is first, hahahaha 😈 )and at age 52, I’ll bet you were there waaaay after I was! But you sound like a fantastic person, and I wish I had been! It is just barely possible I taught you, but I was only on faculty for two years, thank the Lord. 🙄

      3. Come sit next to me, honey.

        Liberal, divorcee, woman with a degree and a career (gasp) and not a SAHM. Barely Methodist now. Not askeered of people of other nationalities, color, creed, or sexual orientation than myself. I could be the poster child for many a sermon. Too bad I’m never going to hear them nor do I count that loss.

        1. You will be that one bogey that I can never be–female. Educated and with a career to boot.

          “What is thy bidding, my master?” /bow

      4. The Greatest Canadian..ever..TOMMY DOUGLAS!

        Lemme see..what else is on my list?
        *Overeducated. Master’s Degree at Secular State U? Yep.
        *Listens to AC/DC
        *Is on Facebook
        *Uses bad language.
        *Drinks.
        *Chews. Used to smoke. Is still tempted.
        *Shameless and in the name of vanity runs 30-35 miles a week to maintain good appearance.
        *Has read 1984, Catcher in the Rye, and Slaughterhouse Five.
        *Owns a NKJV and an NIV.
        *Grew up Lutheran.
        *Is a reformed conservative. Got smart. Now not only vote Democrat–I am very liberal.

        2. Let’s see…how evil am I?
          *Current college student, getting my mind warped while I study for a Bachelor’s in Visual Communication.
          *Listens to rock music, and even plays it on his own internet radio station, corrupting tens of people!
          *Facebook? You bet!
          *Cusses just enough to be sent straight to Hell
          *Has read 1984, Slaughterhouse Five AND The Shack.
          *Has an NIV and a NLT, but no KJV.
          *Goes to the movies.
          *Bikes 30 miles a week to get in better shape…and look better (VANITY!)
          *Fiscally conservative, socially libertarian. (See, double-minded!)
          *Grew up in Southern Baptist churches that used CCM and PowerPoint in services.
          *Horrible father: my adult daughter has tattoos(!) and my son is learning rock guitar.
          *Thinks that all people, regardless of color, creed or religion, are loved by God…even President Obama.

          Am I heathen enough yet? 😈

  20. “… and then there is Rick, my neighbor, who claims to be a Christian, and is pretty nice, but I’m pretty sure he is the one posting on these internet blogs poking fun at the foibles of fundamentalists. My MOG has even mentioned one where they are called “fundies” (but I, of course, have no idea what blogs he means). He says are trying to expose him (um, bring a bunch of false accusations against the church) and are bringing up a bunch of lies, and I shouldn’t believe it, even if it is true. Rick is truly evil – he won’t believe what the MOG says, but keeps bringing up what the Bible says during our discussions.”

    :mrgreen:

  21. Great job in capturing so many stereotypes in a single post!

    I prefer boogey man because when I hear bogey man, all I can think of is “play it again Sam”. My mom used to say booger man which made me very conscious of what may be caught in my nose.

  22. I am so thankful that I left that world of fear and paranoia far behind. I like living life in Bogeyland, a lot less scary.

        1. Which is why it is so important to cook them until they are good and dead. No crispy crunchy vegetables for the fundy crowd!

  24. I remember driving a bus route one Sunday morning, and having a particularly difficult time getting through a narrow pass between two trucks parked on the street. My bus captain said, in all seriousness, that those people probably parked there Saturday night to make it hard on the Church bus. Really? People park on the street in a way just to annoy the church bus?

  25. I just finished this book, Emotional Vampires.. How to Deal with People who Drain you dry. The last chapter is all about paranoids.. as I read it, this is how i felt.. drained dry. When I watch the delivery of pastors (not all of them) but the ones seen alot on this website, spreading fear.. paranoia.. always so serious.. impending doom and gloom.. like John Hagee.. or the left behind stuff.. I wonder how many hard core fundies have a paranoid personality disorder?

  26. Once during college I dyed my hair black….it is still referred to as my “goth stage” by my SIL! Lol.

  27. Oh, another twitch-inducing post! That describes me back when I first started attending an IFB church and believed all that! Going around constantly judging and offended by everything, what a way to live. Yes, I owned the KJV Scoursby tapes, on cassettes mind you. There is a house accross from my fundy church that has a sign in the front lawn that alternates with “Your life is on record” and “Are your sins washed away?” And I think there is a third one but I can’t think of it but all three messages are meant to scare you. I stayed home from church last night and watched “Diary of a Wimpy Kid, Roderick Rules” with my kids last night, it was nice. Since telling my one friend at church that I am going to leave, the flood gates are open and I have told several more people. I am weaning myself gradually but everyone will know why I left from my own lips. I am seriously considering putting the kids in public highschool.

        3. Maybe something a little LONGER than those.. lol! Uh, hmm, Gary, did I ever mention I was an artist? Or are you just very intuitive?

    3. Good luck with getting out. We got out last week and I’ve never felt freer! I don’t dread Sunday! You’ll feel the same after you’re out! 😀

    4. “Going around constantly judging and offended by everything” – well said!!! It IS an awful way to live when God wants us to be joyful, peaceful, loving, humble, and FREE.

  28. I’m reading “Boundaries” for the first time. An IFB church would never do a study on that!

    1. I read that book two years ago. One of the best things I ever did for myself. I hope it will help you learn how to have confidence and avoid the guilt tactics like it did for me. =)

  29. In laws attend an evangelical church that is mostly fundamental.

    Last year, they couldn’t afford to have their four boys play baseball; with four, it was just too expensive. So, them put them into a league that is subsidized by tax dollars. You know, so even poor kids can get a chance to play ball, get social exposure, etc etc.

    The people in the church were bothered by this reliance on the government, and used the best insult they could to make their point: The called them “Democrats”.

    BOO! Bogeyman!

    2. If Democrats are the ones who want everybody to have a chance to play, shouldn’t we all be that kind of Democrat?

    3. My brother was volunteer coach of his son’s community soccer team for a couple of years. He was pretty unpopular with some of the parents because he let even the slower kids play in very game, not just the athletically talented kids (my nephew was actually one of the more athletically gifted ones). I can only imagine what they called him.
      They weren’t quite disgruntled enough that any other parents offered to take over coaching, though.

      1. Gary, please remember the point of any sport, TO WIN, playing your best players is how you are suppossed to do it. The whole let everyone play, even if they can’t kick a ball just laying on hte ground mentality is what’s making so many kids develop into such lousy employees. They think everyone should get the raise, not just the people who performed at the highest levels.

        1. Seriously, Jack Hyles preached this to young people, in the seventies and eighties! He said it was not how you played the game, that only winning counted. Jerk. 👿

        2. The purpose of amateur sports is to have fun, get exercise, and (sometimes) to improve yourself.

          The purpose of *kids* amateur sports is for the kids to have fun, get exercise, learn the sport, and learn to get along.

          The purpose of professional sports is to make money, which often involves winning.

          If a team activity is “win at all costs,” it’s not a sport, it’s war.

      2. These were little kids.

        He didn’t tell them not to try to win, he just didn’t think they would have fun never getting to play.

        Whatever happened to doing your best, whether or not you ultimately win first place? Isn’t that supposed to be a value in sports?

        Say, Chad, did you happen to have a kid on my brother’s team?

        1. No, my son would never play soccer, he hates sports that are team sports. He is into archery and shooting rifles.

    4. Bah. They drive on government-subsidized roads, right? Democrats!!!

      Do they send their letters through the government subsidized postal system? Those Socialists!

      Do they go to their local public LIE-brary? Bunch of heathens!

      🙄

      1. You cannot believe what I get called, nowadays, for working in a library that carries it all, including everything the fundies get their panties wadded up about. I take really overweening pride in the fact, and often must repent of it. The pride, not the being a librarian…

  30. We are to be salt and light. Salt is best if it is in the shaker and the shaker is in the cupboard. Even better if the cupboard is locked. Ideally the cupboard should come with some sort of seal that guards the salt from being contaminated by the outside.

    God also commands to be a light under a bushel. For those of you who do not have a bushel please check with your local fundy church. They will gladly instruct you on how to build a bushel to place over your light and keep the icky dust of the world out.

    The only exceptions that should be made are on Saturday mornings when you should go out in small groups and throw handfuls of salt in the eyes of unsuspecting strangers and shine a light in their face for a couple of minutes. Any other time during the week your salt and light should be sealed off from the world, preferably hermetically.

    1. “…when you should go out in small groups and throw handfuls of salt in the eyes of unsuspecting strangers and shine a light in their face for a couple of minutes.”

      This, Apathetic or Whatever, is great writing. Great in its message, and great in its construction. I salute you. 🙂

    3. LOVE this. So true.

      Sometimes they throw salt on weekdays, too. I had the fundies trolling my neighborhood this morning. I was very disappointed though because they missed my house. =(

    2. Really? That is a new one to me. Why black helicopters? The UN one I am way too familiar with… 🙄

        1. Wow. I have no idea how I missed this whole frame of reference! Thanks for the URL. I HAVE heard that the planes leaving trails in the sky are actually leaving coded messages… sigh. 🙄

    3. Yes, what is the deal about black helicopters?
      Are they worse than other colors of helicopters?

      My wife shouts “Black Helicopters!” whenever someone refers to anything she considers a dubious conspiracy theory,* but I can never get her to explain what she means by that.

      *She’s really a charming person, but this particular habit can get kind of annoying.

  32. The truth in this post rings true. Only now am I able to begin to try to see people as Jesus sees them. Probably one of the hardest things, in my opnion, to change about leaving Fundyland™.

  33. Snap means snap your finger.

    Gotta boogey. Snap. Snap. Snap.
    Gotta boogey. Snap. Snap. Snap.
    Gotta boogey on my finger and I can’t get it off.

    1. “My Daddy said to my Mama,
      You’d better let that boy boogey-woogey.
      It’s in him, and it’s got to come out.”

      — John Lee Hookey, “Boogey Child”

  35. After I actually got to know them, the un-bogeyness of most of most supposed bogeymen surprised me. One of the big things that got me into Catholicism was meeting Catholics who loved Jesus, read the Bible, etc. Shocker! 😯

    Now most fundies don’t know what to do with me. I don’t fit into their neat little bogeyman boxes of either “eeevil Catholic” or “ignorant Catholic”.

  36. Ugh, what a true post and exactly what I had to endure much of my early life. One of the worst examples was when we were visiting my heathen cousins (unsaved worldy Catholics) my mom (former Catholic herself) slept in my cousin’s room and tore down her Mick Jagger poster!

      1. When hubby was single, living on his own, his parents (fundy Mennonites) came to visit. Upon seeing a poster of James Dean with a cigarette somewhere on his person –either smoking it or maybe he had a pack of smokes tucked in his pocket—on his wall, they promptly ripped it off (because they are soooo good at respecting boundaries) saying it “glorified smoking.” 🙄

    2. Faves: Jesuits, Jewish Bankers, and Sesame Street. Sigh of exhaustion after belly laughs. Good Times. 😆

  38. Best.Post.To.Date.
    I have seen all the bogeys and I am afraid no longer. Neither are my kids. Thank God.

  39. Run away! Run away!
    Batton down the hatches and seal the bunker! We all know sin is the ultimate contagian. If you go out in the world you might catch the gay virus, or pick up some sort of liberal bacteria. The worldly flu is going to be pandemic this year so get to the church for a heavy dose of 1611 KJV innoculation against this year’s perverted word flu. wah your hands clean fron the blood of all thise you come incontact with by passing out some healthy Chick Tracts.
    Put on the whole Hazmat suit of god. The selfcontained hermetically sealed Christian bubble suit. Let people know that you are different and that your life is sanctified and set apart when they see you avoiding all appearance of evil in your Independent Fundamental bio suit.

    Yep, nothing says, “my god is soooo tiny, weak, frail and just plain wimpy” like a Christian whose head is wrapped in separated, set apart,sanctimonious tin foil standards.

    4. Too late! I seem to have caught both the gay virus and the liberal bacteria. Now I’m a bogeyman, 1st class. Watch out… 😈

        1. Apparently, Marcus Bachmann used up the last reserves. Though I think he may have got a bad batch: it doesn’t see to have worked… 😈

      2. Oh dear. . . I think I caught the same strains as you. The “doctor” tried an exorcism, and when that didn’t work, fell back on the good old excommunication and banishment. Hurrah!! A deadly outbreak of Bogeymannus Gayus has been averted among the sheeple!! 🙄 🙄 😆

        1. Oh my goodness, there must have been alarms going off all over the facility!

          “We have a Sodom and Gomorrah Rainbow alert, this is not a drill! Repeat this is a Sodom and Gomorrah Rainbow alert! All Prayer warriors are reminded to only bow on one knee during this crisis(to avoid all appearance of evil) and keep your backsides towards the wall to avoid tempting the enemy to attack.”
          “Remember at no time should you attempt to face the enemy alone! One that has been exposed to the Bogeymannus Gayus virus is unclean and should not be engaged in conversation lest you succumb to their worldly logic. The Best defense is to completely shun one such as this. Do not show any love towards them since any compassion might be misconstrued as condoning their sin. Love and compassion may be seen as accepting their lifestyle and we must avoid all appearance of evil. Prayerfully put on the whole Hazmat suit of god and pray that you and your family are not affected by this outbreak. That is all.

          This has been an Alert from the Holier than Thou Broadcast System, we will now return you to the programming already in progress:

        2. Wow, 2 amazing posts! Don, you must have seen my family’s reaction: that was spot on! 😀 Yeah, it’s sad, but it makes me laugh too: so much fear of nothing…

        3. I live in Northern Ireland, and I sometimes wonder if the Gay Rights Movement has most of Western European society by the privates. It is not a crime to be Gay, but it is almost a crime to criticise the Gay lifestyle in any way. A lot of people, especially Christians, a gotten into a lot of trouble for doing just that. So I occasionally wonder if the Fundamentalist’s fear of the Gay BogeyMan may have some basis in reality…

        4. There’s no one Gay Lifestyle. Gays and lesbians I know live in as many different ways as the number of gays and lesbians I know. Some of them are not even sexually active, in case that’s what’s bothering you.

        5. @Don Perfect. Just absolutely perfect. :mrgreen:

          @Diachenko Very true for everyone around me as well.

          Well, except for the PreacherBoy. Being a PreacherBoy, he was above the precautionary rules, so he decided to take on the bogeyman alone via texting: “So what is this I hear about you claiming to believe in Sodomy?” 🙄

        6. OK let me slightly rephrase what I said. It is not politically correct to critisise any form of Gay Lifestyle or be unhappy with what any Gay person may do or say. In fact Failure to endorse any form of Gay activity it now seen as Critisism. I know a number have Christians who have homosexual feelings and are not happy about it and want to change, and are seeking therapy. They have been attacked by the Gay community who say they have no choice in the matter and that is unethical for a therapist to change a persons sexual orientation. I could hunt up some articles about it for you if you want, and post links.

        7. @Paul Best I think that the reason for the LGBT community’s cries of inethicality would be slightly plainer if you looked at things from their side for a little bit.

          Imagine the African-American community’s reaction to a black man that wasn’t happy being what he was and, through medical operations, tried to become white. He would be looked at as a traitor to their kind. What if a Russian tried to pretend to be anything but Russian because he was ashamed of his nationality? He would be branded a traitor to his Russian heritage. What if a Mason or Lion’s Club member ashamedly denied that he was involved in his organization? His comrades would see him as seeing the clubs as too shameful to be honest with the world about.

          So is it really that big of a surprise that when someone is gay but ashamed of it, he is looked on as kind of a traitor to the LGBT community?

          I think a lot of cries of persecution would be avoided if fundies actually looked at the other side objectively and realized that just as much, if not more, persecution IS coming from the fundy camp.

          And as for your friends not being happy being gay and wanting to change, I would just say that if anyone grows up hearing that he is condemned to hell because of what he is, I daresay that he wouldn’t be happy with it when he tries to be a good fundy and still be himself. I can vouch for that, and I’m sure that Diachenko can as well.

        8. “And as for your friends not being happy being gay and wanting to change, I would just say that if anyone grows up hearing that he is condemned to hell because of what he is, I daresay that he wouldn’t be happy with it when he tries to be a good fundy and still be himself. I can vouch for that, and I’m sure that Diachenko can as well.”

          Yes! This. And that is a major part of what angers us so much about this kind of “therapy.” It’s dishonest, it harms people, and it gives the sincere ones a false “hope” that, when taken away as their biology continues to assert itself, can lead to deep depression and worse. Now if someone sincerely believes that being gay is a sin they should be trying to overcome, I will respect their decision to pursue whatever way they wish. But from my own personal experience of trying to “pray away the gay,” that person is in for a world of unnecessary torment, guilt, and turmoil of soul. And if asked, I’ll tell them so.
          @Tchaiko: I’m still laughing about that preacher boy’s text to you. 😀 😀

        9. Are you saying they have NO choice? Is it unethical to change the sexual feelings of someone who might be attracted to members of his own family? Or small boys? Or animals? Even if they want to change? I know it’s not exactly the same thing, but if you push an argument far enough, cracks will appear. Not everyone who has homosexual feels was BORN that way, so it is not inevitable that if they are Christian, they must adopt some form of the Gay Lifestyle, any more than Hetrosexual Christian man should not sleep with women he is not married to. Just my opinion. We can still be friends, I hope. Yes?

        10. Oh, by the way, it is not just Fundies who persecute Gays, it is Christians of all sorts. Doesn’t mean a person should abandon Chritianity because Chritians might not always approve of life choices.

        11. One more comment, then I’ll leave this topic and move on to something else. I know that a lot of Gay people feel considerable anger at Christians. I had a taste of it recently when I bumped into someone who I knew vaguely. Turns out this guy is Gay and when I admitted that I am a Christian, he started to rant about how Christians God and the Bible are Homophobic, and that he has rejected Christianity, and is now an Athiest. What disturbed me was the fact that I couldn’t really argue with a lot of what he said, especially about Christians. I came away feelining like a citizen of Pompeii when Vesuvius erupted, but with a LOT more understanding. I just pray that I am able to show a different face of Christianity to whoever I meet.

  40. As I wrote over on the forum, I have been harassed to death. One woman frequently left Jack Chick stuff at my desk, etc. I’ve also been personally handed tons of Bible tracts, and as I said, I have a collection of hundreds. 23 years in Greenville adds up!

    I started handing back holy cards with Mary on them (later I accelerated that to one with directions on how to say the rosary), each time they gave me one. I told em, you take mine, I’ll take yours. They wouldn’t, so neither would I. Or they would, and then toss them out. If I found them in a wastebasket, I tossed their tract in there too, right next to it. They would say “we can discuss it later” and I told them that we would also be discussing the rosary later, at that same time. Deal? No Deal.

    After I did this awhile, they quit. But it took a couple of years for the entire thing to subside, if you can believe it. They all represented different outfits, and every time some new fundy got hired, started all over again. Only when I got a real reputation for Bogeymanhood did they completely avoid me. But since I am basically “nice” and friendly to everyone–even *that* took a long time.

    Obviously, I just needed the right tract.

    1. Okay, just read up on Videodrome, and no, I would not be able to watch it, because I would never stop having nightmares!
      AS far as reproducing? Shoot. I am in the Holy Heartland, and my late husband would lock eyes with me across a crowded room, and next thing I knew, I was “late.” Those chemtrails did not work on us! :mrgreen:

    1. I know, right? Because she had so much influence. 🙄 And you know, I really like her. She is so intelligent.

    1. I think I mentioned them up there with black helicopters.. if I did not, I meant to do so. I had an uncle who believed it. 🙄

      1. Ohhh I see it now… but I need to make sure you know the Chemtrails are not coded messages but poisons designed to inhibit Good People from reproducing out here in the Holy Heartland. (They are all from New York and Washington. And one person chimed in, Sacramento.) (Sacramento?) THIS is where all the infertility is from. Of course, some infertility is due to nasty sluts with STDs, but you know when *good holy people* are infertile? I’m sure you’ve met some! Well, how did THAT happen? Hm?

        Also, asthma and COPD. And peanut allergies.

        Not sure how those go together (infertility, asthma, etc), but that’s how the speech goes. I just gave it to you straight. 🙂

        There is also a strain of thought that the chemtrails lead to mind control, along with TV, sort of like Videodrome. (if you have never seen that movie, major warning and major caution, not for the faint of heart). Many people would lower their voices at this point and ask me if I had ever seen the movie.

        “Love it!” I’d answer.

        And that was usually the end of THAT conversation.

  43. Dont forget the pagan observance of Lent. I’ve seen fundies purposely order a slab o meat on Fridays tt the local restaurant just to so they can draw attention to the fact they don’t practice this tradition. They actually believe they can bring those heathen waitresses to the Lord that way. Can’t respect anything held sacred by others. Sheesh.

      1. Exactly, though I must admit, even I am surprised at how obnoxious it is to order meat at a restaurant for this reason.

      2. Is that why several of my former classmates from bp-o-tist fundy extreme high school blocked me on Facebook?
        I thought it was because I forgot to use foot powder one day!! 😛 😛 😛

    2. I guess I lost more fundy genes than I thought. When we are up north, I get the Friday Special (Fried Haddock) full well knowing it is the special because of the Catholics.

      Thanks guys–You don’t see many Friday specials like that here in the ol’ Bible Belt.

  45. Recently had a fundie Facebook friend complaining on a staus update about a pesky neighbor who had “hookers” and “floosies”coming and going from his house. The fundie was asking his FB friends what kind of legal action he could take. “Love the sinner,hate the sin” was my response. That stopped the thread right in its tracks.

  46. My sister and I were never allowed to go to my aunt’s house to visit or stay overnight even though she repeatedly asked my parents if we could. Their reasoning was that my aunt wore pants, went to movies, and was Charismatic.

    When I was an adult with a child of my own, I stayed with her for a week. Before I left, my parents told me, “You DO know that she goes to movies and wears pants, right?” Uh, yeah.

    While I was there, I went to their non-denom. Bible church with them. When I told my mom later they go to a Bible church, it shocked her. All those years she thought her sister was Charismatic. But she still wears pants and goes to movies so…

    🙄

    2. The best situation would be if when fundies get to heaven they are made to wear pants, the women, the men would have to wear blue jeans! ;-p

  47. Biggest boogyman in fundieland: the spectre of sin looming within the IFB. All the posturing and posing, all the majoring on the minors, all the cover-everyone’s-ass-because-nobody-really-poops nonsense – it’s all pretending that there is no sin inside the camp. It’s all “out there somewhere.” I should say more here, but I really should be working 😎

    2. Actually my fundie church announced that they are strengthening the rules or whatever to protect kids at the church and school. There is a meeting coming up and everyone who works with children 17 and under is required to attend. So I think this is a positive thing. I am going to attend it to see what they are adding. On the flipside, just found out a teacher was let go at the end of last school year for inapropriate remarks to a girl in the school. I always had a gut feeling that this man was creepy and I now see that my intuition was right!

  49. Did anyone speak about the Boogeymen and women that are in the public school? The first day of public school for my boys they were crying (and me along with them) that I was throwing them into the lion’s den where they would be chewed up and spit out.Shock…they not only found out that their exceptional Christian IFB education was a year behind academically but there were amazingly Godly kids and teachers in the PUBLIC SCHOOL! ❗
    Oh and the same week they attended a non-denom youth group. I go to pick them up and my 11 year old is more excited about God and learning about Him then he ever has and having a ball learning from these liberal boogeymen.. 😯 I am really liking these Boogeymen and women! :mrgreen:

    1. Congratulations on getting the boys into a school that’s at least somewhat less crazy than the one they were in!

    2. Public school can be a lion’s den, but God protects from the lions. Good schools, and good teachers, are everywhere.

  50. “But most of the criticisms I hear of Barack Obama are, in one way or another, objecting to the facts that (1) He is black; and (2) He seems foreign, because he has a funny name, and his father was Kenyan”

    Obsess much?

    1. Michael Dukakis was 2/3 of the way there back in 1988 (incidentally, when Pat Robertson was running) and dealt with some of the same issues. Immigrant parents, funny name. Coincidence?

      1. Yes, in fact, the Lee Atwater/George H.W. Bush campaign organization used some of the same tactics to make Dukakis seem alien and strange and scary to people. Remember Atwater’s statement that his (ultimately successful) strategy was “to make Willy Horton Dukakis’ running mate”? And remember during the debates, how prep-school alum and Yale graduate Bush kept sneeringly referring to Dukakis as “a Harvard professor”? And all the ridiculous grandstandng over the Pledge of Allegiance (calculated to imply that Dukakis was unpatriotic)?

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