368 thoughts on “Reader Submitted Photos: Kentucky Young Fundies”

  2. Ridiculous. No pants/shorts to bed??? I’ll have to give them this – at least they are being consistent. What if my culottes only make it 6 in. Below my knee? Will there be an officially trained staff member to check and see if my culottes meet the appropriate standard of self-righteousness?

    1. I love how the camp directly addressesses the PASTOR (not the parent) and how it is implied that their standards won’t change because they’re taken from God’s Word. Yeah, show me the chapter and verse on girls not wearing jammies to bed.

      Oh, your line about culottes meeting the appropriate standard of self-righteousness? Awesome!

      1. It’s more than implied, it’s directly stated they are upholding the standards taught in the Word of God.

        I’m assuming the guys have to shower in full length pants too.

    2. As a non-fundy myself, I’ll NEVER understand the whole pants=bad, culottes=good thing. Because culottes are most certainly pants… UGLY pants, but pants nonetheless. They are so all-or-nothing on everything else, so why do culottes get a pass? I guess it’s just another example of how I need to quit trying to understand ridiculous rules that are impossible to understand!

    3. The girls are not allowed to wear pants or skirts to bed so that the abusive worker will not have to struggle. 😥

      Whenever I see these types of rules I wonder what type of perverse sins these people are hopefully struggling with.

  3. I love that most of the code of conduct has to do with the paltry details of ‘suitable’ dress.
    And like I’m handing over my medication to the camp nurse…

    1. I noticed that too. The Ladies’ Code of Conduct should be relabeled Dress Code.

      And they’re quibbling over cullotes which are allowed and gauchos which aren’t. I’m sad that there’s enough people with enough kids to allow this camp to keep running with this draconian dress code.

        1. Because for a very brief moment in time, gauchos were trendy. If culottes were ever to become trendy (God forbid!), they’d have to eschew those as well for some other type of shroud.

        3. Traditions change. I remember when culottes were forbidden in public school, let alone church camp. Oh my if she gets to like having something between her legs, the next thing you know she might be taking on the whole football team!

      2. Yes, but they really are being reasonable. There are many kinds of culottes that they _do_ allow :rolleyes

    3. They should look up Conduct in the dictionary. It refers to how you act, not how you dress and what you stuff in your suitcase.
      You know, like “treat others with respect.” Oh never mind…

    2. I went to camps like this and, dress code aside, we usually had a great time. I still have a lot of good memories. It’s like your narrow-mindedness toward all things you declare “fundy” is blinding you to the fact that the kids who attend might actually have a good time.

        1. And you know that a lot of kids have a crappy time because you’ve interviewed them? You’ve done the research to determine that a lot of kids have a crappy time? Or are you simply projecting your own negative experience onto others? Also, what exactly does a “counterfeit Christianity” look like? Are you such an expert in the real deal that you can spot the counterfeit immediately? Where can I get training like that?

        2. Well, Jonathan, I had a crappy time,and so did my kids, and my friend’s kid. In fact the only kids I saw having fun were the group from a large IFB church who spent the week bullying everyone who was not from that church.

        3. I also had a crappy time. It was all the rules that sucked the fun right out of it. Not to mention “adults” who acted anything but.

        5. Jonathan:

          You apparently don’t understand what this site is about. Please return after a thorough study of previous posts and comment sections. Your questions will be answered during your study.

          Until then, go away. Trolls have a tendency of being dog-piled around here. 😈

        7. @Halcyon,

          I find it interesting that because my point of view differs from yours, I’m labeled a troll. I visit this site every day…hardly makes me a troll. Seems to me that this is simply another example of the narrow-mindedness of the majority of the posters on this site. Thanks for proving my point.

        8. “I find it interesting that because my point of view differs from yours, I’m labeled a troll.”

          Jonathon, you are right–just disagreeing with someone does not make you a troll. Sorry. That does happen on this site from time to time. It’s a tough bunch. But please hang with us, it does get better.

        10. I went four times: first two were at Trinity and weren’t too great because I didn’t know anyone lol The last time I went with my sisters and several cousins and we had a blast.

          I went to the camp my current church has, and bleh. There really wasn’t a lot to do, I didn’t know anyone, and the church high schoolers weren’t that nice at all. I was a newbie to the church as well.

      2. Oh, yeah, strict purdah, no touching, swim fully clothed, dress clothes for chapel services and competitions, no books allowed, and the theme of the camp is “Flee also youthful lusts.” That really sounds like two tons of fun.
        Do you have any idea what kinds of things kids do at a normal summer camp?

      3. Oh, these camps were horrible. Not only the draconian rules, but being stuck in the boonies for a week with a bunch of self-righteous bullies on staff and among the students isn’t exactly what I’d call spiritually edifying.

      4. @ Jonathan, I don’t think they’re arguing that one can’t have a good time at these camps. I believe they are arguing that it is ridiculous to have these silly rules in the first place. Especially when the leaders of the camp pass those silly rules off as from the Word of God. All they are are man made rules that don’t teach kids anything about the world they live in and how they need to handle it. It does teach them however, to judge others who don’t do exactly what they do.

        1. I actually went to camps like this, and to tell you the truth, it was a waste of a week of my summer.

      5. I went to these camps too. I had moments of good times. What I remember most is being 18 and they found out I brought pajama shorts. That night Scott Gray preached on how horrible pajama shorts/pants, blockbuster cards and sundry other items were. We were humiliated until we went to the cabin got our offending items and laid them on the altar. My brother was the YP so I got a good butt chewing from him afterwards. How was I to know you couldn’t bring pajamas? I thought that is what normal people slept in.
        I was again pointed out in split session for not swimming in the hole that was obviously groing some kind of fungus. Girls were covered in it. Not to mention you had to wear a t shirt that went to your knees over your swimsuit to swim! Seriously who owns one of those! I sure didn’t. I also got called out for wearing a straight skirt and had to change. All these thing I got called out for were either ridiculous or perfectly acceptable in my fundy home.
        I wanted to go back to HAC after that week. Oh and did I mention I was supposed to be a counselor. Yeah I was a regular camper after the first day.

        1. I’m kind of confused about this no-pajama rule. Do Fundies insist that everyone sleep in the nude? After all, there are no pajamas or nightgowns mentioned in the Bible, to the best of my recollection.

      6. @Jonathan, kids are resilient. They make the best of things, especially if it’s all they know. I’ve ridden horseback in culottes; I’ve canoed in culottes; I’ve gone swimming with t-shirts over my swim suit. I had fun, but I also was embarrassed and my fun was diminished by being constantly aware of my ridiculous clothing, the wide legs of the culottes dragging in the water at the bottom of the boat or the exaggerated flapping in the wind as I tried to bike in culottes.

        We’re sad that young people are told that this is the only way to be right with God and that if you want to be spiritual, you’ll have no problems with any of these extra-biblical, man-made standards.

        1. Believe me, I am as opposed to kids being told that they have to do certain things to be right with God as most of you are. We are actually experiencing something similar at my church right now. I can’t tell you how many times I threw away my entire music collection because some guy told me that certain styles of music were sinful, only to buy them back later. The issue that I have is all of the derogatory comments that are being leveled at this camp, especially when most of us have never been. I realize that there are a lot of really bad things about fundamentalism, but to paint every single IFB church with the same “the pastor has a mistress, the elders abuse girls and cover it up, the men of the church disrespect their wives” is unfair. In reality, this just serves to cause disunity in the body of Christ.

        2. Jonathan – you say there are a lot of bad things about fundamentalism – this is one of them

      7. I’m sure the only kids who had a “great” time were the ones who had the same ridiculous rules at home. This is not a camp to bring an unsaved friend to. And I’m sure you had more fun because you didn’t have to wear culottes.

      8. Johnathan, I think one thing you are missing is that you are a guy. The rules for guys is SO much shorter than it is for the girls. Girls can’t even have zipper or pockets less they look like they are wearing pants. Guys get to do the fun physical activities like rock climbing, and the obstacle course looking wall, not to mention the boy doing the flip. With the dress code (Code of Conduct 🙄 )there is no way a girl can do any of those activities and stay modest. All of the pictures featured on the brochure show boys doing fun activities and girls watching.
        I’m glad that I never experienced a camp like this, and that my children never will either.

        1. You took the words out of my mouth. If you were a guy, the camp had at least moments of fun. If you were a girl, you got hot, tired, and bored. And the sermons would then fill you with guilt.

        2. You made me look at the pictures again, and you’re absolutely right. Only boys are shown playing; the girls only get to watch. 😥
          They don’t even get to look at the Bible; they’re just watching a man read from his Bible. 😥

      9. I went to camps like this my entire childhood (13+ separate times!) and the experiences I had were some of the worst of my life. I LOATHED camps like this.

    1. Clearly, you were never aware of the tremendous conspiracy of wickedness that produced jam shorts. That threat could return at any time!

      At any time!!

      1. If you don’t wear pegged pants, your zoot suit is going to look funny when you go to the malt shop.

  7. Lots of legalese, but they leave enough holes and ambiguity to drive a Mack truck through. No mixed swimming? What if you do not intend to swim? Is mixed wading permitted? What about just ogling. How far away from the pool do the boys have to be while the girls are swimming and vice versa? Are adult men banned during girls swimming. My church avoided the confusion by banning “mixed bathing.”

    1. Don’t worry, that no mixed swimming may sound like a loophole, but I guarantee there’s no chance the boys will ever get near pool when the girls have it, and vice versa. 🙂

      1. My one and only experience with a fundy “encampment” had a swimming pool with an 8-foot fence all the way around its perimeter. That solved that problem, for sure.

  9. Fundie Programming 211. This is a 200 level course in applied Fundie programming. Through the use of distractions and games (of an appropriate spiritual nature) we will be sontinuing the behavorial modification that it takes to produce an unquestioning, fully programmed adult fundie. This is a critical time for these young fundies and we must keep them distracted enough to not see the way we are moulding their behavior, and thought patterns. Successful completion of this course will prepare the individual for additional suggestions regarding the direction we believe their life should go, including what post secondary college or university they should attend to prepare them for Full-Time Christian Service.

      1. nope, my RA made me get a haircut a while back, so it’s still above my ears….. :mrgreen:

  11. Here is how the ESV and the NIV translate the passage they are building this idea of abstaining from all appearance of evil on:

    22 Abstain from every form of evil. (ESV)

    22 reject every kind of evil. (NIV)

    These say nothing about avoiding the appearance of evil.

    No wonder fundamentalists baptists hate these new Bible versions so much, they dismantle their most treasured doctrinal belief – absolute separation.

    1. What’s keeping them from going full-blown Amish? At least the Amish make a pretty good effort at total separation from the world. Hyper-fundies would rather pick and choose what is “worldly” and what is not based on their own whims.

      What a legalistic joke.

      1. This is another example of applying contemporary understanding to King James english. The people of the 1600s would have clearly understood the verse to say evil when it appears not anything that looks like evil.

    2. If they really want to avoid evil then they would not attend camps like this.
      -The evil is covered with the holier-than-thou mindset.
      -The evil is in the cult practices of separation. The evil is in the indoctrination of judgment… “You have to keep our standards or you are not Right with God.”
      -The evil is in the fact that this in NO way prepares young people to face the world in which they live.
      -This in NO way prepares them to be a light and a witness to the world around them, instead it prepares them to be Pharisees and Sadducees more concerned about appearance than Truth.

      Grrrrrrr!

  12. There’s no mixed bathing, and the guys have to swim in long pants anyway! I always felt bad for kids stuck with a-hole parents sending them to these idiotic places!

      1. The only explanation I can come up with that is they must think seeing other guys without shirts is what causes homosexuality? This is just something I completely do not understand.

    3. They also don’t have any pictures of the girls from just about the bodice line down. Just their faces.

    4. Just like happy smiling North Koreans, dancing Joyfully with Great Enthusiam before Comrade Dear Leader!

  14. I live about 1 1/2hrs from there. Bro Fugate is very close with the pastor of the fundy church I just left. I’ve heard him preach many times and I know several people from his church, although I never went to conferences or anything at their church. Fugate is so much a separatist he separates from some other fundies in the movement.

        1. I like to think of myself as 2 or 3 times separated from Jack Schaap! Don’t go trying to get it in fewer, Shoes.

        3. You can find articles from that sad debate here:

          http://hacalumni.com/

          Schaap refused to call the KJV inspired. He just said it was preserved. A whole issue on thia was pulblished in Church Bus News saying he was separating from Schaap. Russel Anderson got involved sending a letter to a bunch of churches and even talking to the dead Jack Hyles in the letter. The saddest part was that parts of the debate was arguing who was closest to Jack Hyles. Fugate accused Schaap of depating from what Hyles belived, Schaap said that they were the same as Jack Hyles. Gail Riplinger got involved. It was just all a big sad mess.

        4. I read a bunch of that site on a boring weekend one time. I e-mailed whoever it was (Dave something maybe?) let him know that I appreciated the good laugh at all of his & Schaap’s insane behavior, and just naked rage bleeding from his website. He responded, I didn’t even read whatever his idiotic response was before deleting.

  15. Notice how the ladies code of conduct is 5 times the gentleman’s code of conduct.

    My favorite is for the culottes: “no zippers and/or pockets in front that give the appearance of pants.” hahahhahah!

    2. But…but…the appearance of pants is the appearance of EVIL! Have to avoid that, whether it’s in the Bible or not.

      1. When I was kid I could wear pants or shorts if the zipper was on the side or in back. Then one day in the late sixties, even that rule disappeared, and I could wear pants with a zipper in the front. Oh to be so liberated!

    3. Yeah, that was pretty pathetic. They even go so far to tell the ladies that they can’t have any “whiskering or fades” on their jeans…but that rule doesn’t apply to the boys, apparently. Why so much focus on the girls? Oh, yeah, I already know the answer to that one…

    4. I wore coulottes for years. I can’t believe it but I don’t think any of mine would pass inspection at this camp. If there aren’t any zippers, do they just have elastic waist bands? I bet they have to tuck their shirts in too, thats a classy look.
      7″ to 8″ below the knee! Wow, I haven’t seen that rule before either. That would put it just about to my ankle, then I might be accused of wearing pants.

        1. I would have presumed that too if it hadn’t said NO zippers.

          I think CAPSLOCK SHIRLEY wrote their promo material for them.

        2. CAPSLOCK SHIRLEY hand is all over this thing. “All caps on all the NOs. Now let’s see…caps on the words MUST, ONLY and ALL. um, er, now FOOD, PREACHING…”

  16. Even in my loyalest, most earnest fundy days, I would never have found a large silouette of Billy Sunday swinging his fists while preaching as an appealing image.

    And noice the activities too: Bible preaching, Bible Quiz, Bible Drill, Food, and Games. In my opinion this is not written to appeal to teens (despite the silly smooshed smiley face and the weird guy eating pizza); it’s for parents.

    1. It is addressed to Pastors, not parents. No sense in letting those parents decide (poorly in fundies opinion) what is right for their kids, advertise to the Pastors, and have them tell the parents where they are allowed to send their kids.

    2. I don’t think those activities are what they will be doing at the camp. I will admit, though, that it does sound like a pretty lame youth activity.

  17. Wait, the counselors have to turn in their medication as well 😯 Now I’m wondering what the counselor rule book looks like. Would being a counselor count as a 300 level course? (See Don’s reply up thread)

    1. Yeah, this basically sent a red flag to me, saying “if you have any medical condition that requires medication…STAY AWAY!!” Seriously, why is this rule here, especially if, say a kid has asthma or something else fairly common among kids?

      1. So a person in need of meds can faint and be prayed over.

        I went to the only local summer camp as a kid; it was run by Baptists, but they were usually pretty cool–there were even the old Blish Star Trek episode novelizations on the bookshelf in the common room. HOWEVER, the guest preachers were a mixed bag. One year this weird intense hairy guy showed up and preached fire and brimstone in the tiny chapel with the exquisite stained glass windows. I tuned him out, of course, but the next day of camp, somebody fell down and was injured–something about clutching a shin and bleeding, I forget exactly what happened. So at evening chapel, he called her forward and suddenly BLARARG NAAAGLE BLAHAAAAGA MUNAWA TOOOO GONEINGEDD like he had had some kind of psychotic break!

        I was terrified. The injured girl was sobbing in fear and begging him to stop. Of course he kept going, until some cue or other led him to proclaim victory over the spirits that had caused her to slip and fall, or whatever.

        That one experience immunized me against Charismatic churches for life.

        He wasn’t back next year, BTW.

      2. God forbid a kid need an Epi-Pen right away. I understand that they don’t want kids dispensing their own medication, but to not even allow the flexibility of a kid with an immediate medical need to be allowed immediate access to their medication is criminal.

    2. Can you imagine the nurses having to hand out Viagra or Preparation H? Sounds like a nightmare.

  19. I wonder if the girls are even allowed to climb that climbing wall shown in the picture? If they are, I hope no male counselors are standing below while they “modestly” expose themselves with culottes flapping in the breeze.

    2. Of course not, don’t you think that is one of the main reasons they keep girls in culottes? It keeps active girls in their place on the sidelines. You can’t really swim, participate in games, play sports in culottes and be modest. If they were really worried about girls being modest and not revealing anything private, 🙄 culottes are not the way to go. It is just one more way for the men to control the women and make them feel inferior.

      1. I remember being sat down at one of these fundy camps (a lenient one perhaps; our culottes only had to be “below” the knee) and told that anything above the knee would turn guys on, and thus the covering. They went into some detail to make sure we understood how guys felt about our over-the-knee legs.

        All this occurred during devo time (the only girl “devo time” we ever had that week). As I sat there listening, I couldn’t help but think that knees weren’t even all that attractive, and that I didn’t understand these men who could be excited by such a mundane thing.

        I didn’t reject the ideas then, just thought they were pretty incomprehensible.

        1. I remember being sat down at one of these fundy camps (a lenient one perhaps; our culottes only had to be “below” the knee) and told that anything above the knee would turn guys on, and thus the covering.

          Uh, isn’t that the same rationale X-Treme Islam uses to justify the burqa?

      2. I think there’s two approaches to this: 1) the old-fashioned, “Victorian” idea that women are weak and unsuited to certain activities; the encouragement of certain clothing then inhibits women from participating in “masculine” activities. I’ve actually not seen that too much. Instead I’ve seen 2) women legalistically wearing culottes but still participating in everything the guys do. Thus with my own eyes I saw a girl hanging gamely onto the rope in a tug-of-war game and getting pulled across the floor. Her culottes rode up as far as they could go and her entire leg was exposed up to the panty line in the gymnasium of the church school. Girls also ski, climb rock walls, etc. in culottes. Thus they self-righteously are keeping the OT diction of “not wearing that which pertaineth to a man” but they often being immodest! How silly to be proud of keeping a tradition (no pants on women), but fail to realize that you are failing to keep the spirit of the law which is modesty.

    3. I’ve always wondered if the dress thing wasn’t to allow easier access for the molestors. And “impure thoughts”? Is she wearing panties? Those people are pathetic. 😡

      1. Sounds like you’ve got a lot of experience with those “impure thoughts” you are decrying.

      2. Though to be fair, I haven’t seen anything like that in either of the camps I attended.

        Not saying it doesn’t exist, but in my very humble opinion I’d imagine it isn’t the norm.

    4. Or the high ropes course? I notice they only showed a picture of boys on the walkway; girls in culottes would be immodest on a high highway of ropes like that.

  20. I notice that records, 8 tracks, and beta players are not forbidden. As these standards never change, one can only assume they’ve never been forbidden in the past. I sense a loophole just waiting to be exploited. 😈

    1. How about my transistor radio? Or even my HD-DVD (that’s gone the way of the betamx, too…)

  21. I was ready to sign up until I saw I couldn’t bring my cassette player. What about my portable 8 track player? Can I still bring that?

    Also, typo alert. Counselor is spelled cousellors in the code of conduct. Saying cousellors out loud sounds like “cusselors” which sounds like they are proficient in cussing which is evil and now I must abstain from them.

    1. It’s send to other Pastors who are also too worried about what people are wearing to have learned how to spell, so no harm done. 🙂

  22. …and what is listed on this flyer is the best of what will be happening for the week! I don’t want to think too long about what the “preaching” will be about!?!

  23. Just an observation: You have to wonder whether all these restrictions contribute to the high incidence of just-out-of-high-school marriages that I’ve witnessed among fundy kids. That suppressed, pent-up sexuality has to find some outlet of expression, and of course “It is better to marry than to burn . . . ” I’ve known quite a few fundy young people who would have gone to college had not their sex drive steered them otherwise. At 20, they and their spouses are struggling financially and in some cases already have two kids.

    2. I’m coming to the conclusion that “Married” is just Christianese for Getting Laid.

      You see fundy girls who are Marriage-crazy instead of boy-crazy…

      You see fundy guys using “God Hath Revealed Unto Me” con jobs to high-pressure fundy girls into marrying them (like invoking a magick love charm to force them into it)…

      You see near-Moonie mass weddings at Bible colleges when a major Rapture scare blows through (“The End of The World! We’re All Gonna Die! I Don’t Wanna Die a Virgin! Just Once!”)…

      There’s a technical term called “a Marriage of Continence”. It refers to entering into marriage ONLY to legalize the sex.

      And with such an obsession on Getting Married, I wonder whether the incidence of Disney Princess Wedding Fantasies, Bridezilla Syndrome, and divorce is higher among fundys than the general population. Justification By Marriage Alone sounds like a good way to put so much time, money, and energy into the wedding there’s none left over for the marriage afterwards.

    3. I was married at 20–dh was 22. We have managed to survive for going on 15 years and both of us have bachelor degrees. I don’t regret getting married as young as we did, but looking back there were many things we missed out on in our 20s because we married so young. I’ve come to the conclusion that there are MUCH worse things my children can do as adults than have sex outside of marriage. Yes, I know there are consequences and I will strongly encourage them to wait for marriage, but that act alone isn’t going to determine their eternal fate.

      1. There is another bit of strange fundie logic. Sex before marriage does not disqualify a man from becoming a fundie deacon or minister (nor does murder according to “Unshackled”) but if a person is divorced, they are a permanent second class citizen. So my advice to fundie youth, just do it! Get it out of your system. Use protection of course. I know many fundies who were sexual active and nothing bad happen to them. My brother’s “friends with benefits” girlfriend went to BJU and became a preachers’ wife, even wore a white wedding dress. When my brother saw her wedding photo on Facebook he said that girl should not have even had her teeth whiten for the wedding.

  24. If I hear one more self-righteous Pharisee defend their idolatry by abusing ἀπὸ πάντος εἴδους πονηροῦ ἀπέχεσθε, I think I’m going to vomit. P.S. The KJV did not mis-translate here…its just that English has sufficiently evolved in the last 400 years that the translation means something different to modern ears. Anyway, abusing God’s word this way to defend one’s made-up religion is disturbing.

  25. Number of times ‘no’ is mentioned: 24. Number of times ‘God’ is mentioned: 3. Number of times Jesus, Christ, Christianity, growth, fruits of spirit, Holy Spirit is mentioned: 0.

    1. And 2 of those mentions of God are in the phrase “The Word of God”.
      So it’s not even God. It’s the Bible. KJV version I’m sure (although it is not specifically mentioned). The fourth member of the Trinity.

    2. Much more about what you can’t wear, and how you can’t touch each other, than about God’s love. That’s about par for the course.

    3. ding, ding, ding. we have a winner (“no” wins over “Jesus” 24-0).

    4. If you step back and look at the flyer all you see is NO NO NO NO
      NO NO NO NO NO NO
      NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

      NO NO NO
      NO NO

      Now get out there and have fun kids!

      1. This isn’t a church camp. It’s the Unholy Spirit from Aldous Huxley’s Ape and Essence!

  26. So, they are basically wearing 3-piece suits to summer camp in KY. Sounds appealing…

    1. KY is where they have The Creation Museum and coming Ark Experience theme park — must be something in the water there.

  27. Guns, knives, fireworks, playing cards, weapons – just how do playing cards fit into that list. You gonna kill someone with a deck of cards?

  28. The theme verse is “flee youthful lusts.” How original.

    Also, “no books.” Thank God. I’d hate for a young person to “study to show himself approved.”

    1. I’ve got to say, I was a bit flabbergasted by the “no books” rule. That’s just…bizarre. Not even a Hyles booklet? 😛

    4. The fundy camp I attended as a kid forbade books other than the KJV. The reason given was that you were supposed to be getting away from “worldly influences” while you were there. 🙄 I will neither confirm nor deny that I (a bookworm) followed that rule every year. 😉 For that matter, the year I was on staff there, the majority of staff members broke that rule and the one against bringing playing cards.

      1. I wouldn’t have been able to give up reading books for a whole summer!

        BTW, I wish camps would stop focusing on clothing rules and avoiding books and cards and focus on teaching and modeling love, peace, and compassion.

  29. I noticed the list of clothing rules is much longer for females than the rules for males. Hmmm.. Apparently, females are more evil than males.

    1. Daniel, didn’t you see the Jack Schaap video about a week ago? Women are responsible for the fall of man!

    1. KJV spelling = sanctified. C’mon, you haven’t seen anything about Saviour vs Savior?

    2. Just once, on a wacko site featured here on SFL.

      This is America, not England… I can understand, I guess, if they are quoting Scripture.

  31. By the way, the whole “appearance of evil” thing is really getting old.
    The word “appearance” as we think of it is the was something seems or looks, or appears to be. In the 17th century, “appearance” meant something closer to occurrence or manifestation. The word for word Greek translation is more like “avoid every kind of evil.”
    It has nothing to do with looking like the world and avoiding something that might be perceived as evil. It literally means to simply avoid evil.

  32. Anyone else notice the “for such a time as this”? Are fundies teaching that Esther became queen by dressing modestly nowadays?

        1. @ ML, I never heard that before. I, unfortunately, grew up in the fundy circles. Can you point me to a passage in the Bible for that?

        5. I’ll always picture her [Esther] as a slender beautiful asparagus.

          Only in Veggie Tales.

        6. Yep, Esther had to audition for the queen’s position, and she didn’t just sing and dance for him. Keep in mind that she had no choice in the matter, nor did all the other young virgins who were brought to the palace for their “audition”. More than likely she was in her early teens, having just reached menarche, and the king was a mean, nasty, older man. In other words, she was raped by a pedophile. One can only assume that if the same thing were to happen today, at least two fundy leaders out there would tell her to apologize to the king for tempting him so badly.

        7. It’s an odd choice for a camp that prides themselves in how well they enforce modesty.

  34. I love the guy in a dune buggy being pushed by 12 guys behind him. Ummm isn’t that supposed to have an engine in there? Or are they too cheap?

    1. Yeah, I assume that has to be they got stuck or ran out of gas, and just got a great story out of it, maybe?

    2. We did something like that at our camp. We had an old VW bug that the engine had been removed from, and it was equipped with bars that made it easy to push. The counselor would get in the driver’s seat and then the kids in that cabin would push it around a course, one car at a time, each cabin trying to be the fastest. It was actually a lot of fun!!!

  36. I’m sorry, but that place just looks boring as sin. I would drive myself nuts having to run around in a pair of jeans in the middle of the summer. Oh wait, I definitely did just that for six summers.

    1. Actually, this place looks a LOT more boring than sin! Pretty much every sin I can think of sounds a lot less boring than this nightmare! 😆

      3. Guess I’ll have to watch my euphemisms in the future. “Boring as sin” seemed more situationally appropriate than the other phrase that crossed my mind.

  37. I just noticed something. The “Ladies Swimwear” guidelines says “Dark clothes with dark top ONLY.” Um, does this mean pants/shorts/bottoms are optional?

    1. They spent ALL that time delineating women’s clothing rules (including what you can SLEEP in!), and I’m still completely confused as to what you’re supposed to wear swimming? Dark pants over a bathing suit? A long dark skirt? A burqua?

        3. The Baptist Ranch would never allow some of those Victorian bathing costumes. They expose the knees.

      2. I think it’d be better for everyone if the girls just got some more modesty training in lieu of swimming! 😉

  38. Possibly, which makes it odd that there is a prohibition of iPods. Whatever happened to “will not change?”

  40. Wow. Just wow.

    Amazing, too. that NO has to be in all capital letters, b/c, obviously, if it was in lower case, we might think they weren’t serious.

  41. Geez. The one year we thought about my going to summer camp while at the fundy church, my parents and I read something like this and laughed hysterically. There was NO way (for one thing, my parents couldn’t have afforded to buy me an entire new wardrobe just for summer camp). I did finally end up going to a one-week camp at Windemere, but that was with the SBC, and their rule was decent shorts, no bare midriffs, and one piece bathing suits. That at least made some sense (although we still had to go out and find me a new bathing suit–I have figure for which is hard to find a one-piece that fits). 😕

    1. I put my kids in a (Shhhh) public school this semester. After last semester of about 2 pages of dress code for Kindergarteners I look up the dress code for the public school. 2 rules: No foul language on clothing, no midrifts. That’s it. Nothing like giving the power of common sense back to the parents. Thanks public school.

      1. Yay yay yay! Thank you, thank you, thank you! I wish my parents had been sane enough to let me go to public school! 🙂

      2. We did the same thing when we moved to a new area. The only Christian school in the area had the most unbelievable rules for dress starting in K5. The boys had to have certain colored SOCKS on certain days of the week. 😯 There were rules about the type and color belts they could wear as well as which days they need to wear the different belts. And that was just socks and belts! The rules for dress section was several pages long! Failure to follow the dress rules resulted in demerits. With five boys in elementary to help get ready each morning, I told hubby I would never be able to keep all of it straight and the boys would most likely be expelled before the first month ended! 🙄

      3. My parents sent me to public school all along… I think that’s what kept all three of us (Mom, Dad, and I) from becoming indoctrinated–we didn’t cut ourselves off! I still have some self-esteem issues from junior high and the cliques, but at least I know how to handle that crap now. Other things (like dating) I didn’t experience until college or later, and I’m the epitome of awkwardness in them.

      4. Shhh don’t tell, but I teach in one of those evil public schools. 😈 Funny thing is it is nothing like what we were told. I spent 10 years teaching in a private Christian School and now 10 years in public schools. There is no comparison. Public school = tougher curriculum, compassionate, caring teachers, supportive staff and administration, and superior facilities. I didn’t find any of those things in my Christian school.

  42. Why don’t they just hand out a long ugly gunny sack to each girl as they come in.

    I had a couple people agree but I also got flack for my FB comment on culottes the other day.

    “Culottes are the devil’s joke on religious people. And poor, godly submissive women are the butt of the joke.”

    1. They could work out a deal with PCC to use their blue sacks that food service girls wear while school is out in the summer. Shudder, I hope they don’t still wear those.

  43. The red silhouette preacher guy is creepy… doesn’t he look like he’s about to give a beat down. Why do Fundies feel that preaching is a beating? Shouldn’t preaching be edifying?

    1. That silhouette is of none other than Billy Sunday. And yes, he did pretty much see preaching as a beatdown.
      Or, as he put it:
      “I’m against sin. I’ll kick it as long as I’ve got a foot, and I’ll fight it as long as I’ve got a fist. I’ll butt it as long as I’ve got a head. I’ll bite it as long as I’ve got a tooth. And when I’m old and fistless and footless and toothless, I’ll gum it till I go home to Glory and it goes home to perdition!”

        1. Besides being THE Celebrity Preacher of the World War One period, Billy Sunday was also a recovering alcoholic. Most of his sermons were against Demon Rum instead of for Christ, and he was one of the main movers and shakers behind Prohibition (i.e. the Big Christian Culture War issue of the day).

          One Christian blogger called Billy Sunday the type example of “I have this problem, so all of you MUST have the same problem!”

        2. If I remember right, it was Billy Sunday who, when the Eighteenth (Prohibition) Amendment was ratified, said that all the prisons, poorhouses, asylums, and hospitals in the country would soon close for want of inmates.

          Preacher boys take note: Making predictions is a risky business.

    2. “Shouldn’t preaching be edifying?”

      It is in the fundy world. If you consider edifying as getting convicted of the sin in your life. And I’m not talking about your run-of-the-mill sin. I’m talking about send-you-straight-to-hell sin. Sin like:
      Missing a Wednesday night service
      Listening to rock music
      Voting for a democrat
      Not tithing 10% of gross income
      :mrgreen:

  44. Someone mentioned Windermere. I’ve never heard of them, but here’s their dress code. Much more reasonable, in my opinion.

    “Our dress code is simple… be modest. Final interpretation on the meaning of “modest” rests on the
    AreaOne staff. Here are a few guidelines to observe:
    ‣ Absolutely NO bikinis or Speedos.
    ‣ If your bathing suite requires a t-shirt to be worn over it, it must be long and dark colored.
    ‣ No tight clothing.
    ‣ “Short” shorts or “short” skirts. Stand with your arms by your side. If your fingertips are touching your
    skin, your shorts or skirt are too short.
    ‣ Spaghetti strap tops or small tank tops.
    ‣ If your belly is showing, you will be changing into something else.
    ‣ Clothing with questionable saying, slogans, etc.”

    Isn’t that refreshing?

    1. Yes. I like reasonable rules. I don’t mind a camp asking girls not to be in skin-tight, spaghetti-strapped, belly-baring shirts. Moderation is the key!

    2. I went to Word of Life (twice) and their short length rule was the same – ‘fingertip length.’ Cracks me up now . . . I would not be caught dead in shorts that short and I generally get the long shorts for my 4-yr-old daughter but that’s just me and my aversion to “prostitot” clothes.

  45. I think what is funny is they have this crazy sleeping dress standards for girls but nothing for the guys! My buddy in college always slept in the buff! Wonder if there will be any problem if that happens? What about guys running around shirtless in the dorm? You know that is the norm when you get a bunch of guys together. So what modesty is there in that? Seems like the focus is way off at this place.

    1. Agreed, I find demanding teenage girls to wear nightgowns deeply disturbing. Floor length nightgowns or sleep shirts? they don’t mention a hemline in that rule.
      In the meantime, most guys sleep in their underwear no?

      2. It is disturbing. Women aren’t even given privacy when they are sleeping. They must always be on guard against tempting men.

        Just how exactly are women who are sleeping alone in their own beds tempting men?

        Oh, right, I forgot. Women are the source of all evil. /facepalm

    2. Not to mention, these girls will be in an all-girl dorm/cabin. Other than seeing other girls, what’s the harm in pajamas? Are they that worried that boys might wander over and sneak a peek? They certainly didn’t think it through for the other way around.

  46. 17 lines of text for the Ladies’ Code of Conduct, and only 5 lines of text for the Gentleman’s Code of Conduct.

    Jack Schaap would approve.

    1. …and no laptops! We don’t want our camper’s minds being corrupted by evil websites like StuffFundiesLike.com! :mrgreen:

  47. I’m glad to see it’s called Circle C BAPTIST Ranch and not Circle C CHRISTIAN Ranch. If it were the latter, that would be deceptive advertising. :mrgreen:

    1. Problem is, a lot of fundys have redefined the word “Christian” without any qualifiers to mean Their Kind of Christian and Their Kind of Christian Alone.

      I’m in Furry Fandom; you can only do so much to distance yourself from crazies who hijack your name and proclaim to everyone that they are one of you and you are one of them. And if you change your name, what stops them from hijacking that one, too?

      1. A not-inconsiderable number of evangelical and moderate Baptist churches have changed their names in recent years because the IFBs and the Southern Baptists have caused the noun “Baptist” to have such negative connotations in the wider culture. The wife of an evangelical American Baptist pastor friend of mine went to a women’s gathering in their town a few years ago, and when she told the woman seated next to her that she was a Baptist, the response was a drippingly dismissive “Oh.”

        Their church changed its name to something generic not long afterward. She remarked, “Everyone thought we were a bunch of fundies.”

  49. A Ranch- a large farm for raising horses, beef cattle, or sheep.

    A Baptist Ranch- a large farm where the managawd and his minions indoctrinate and browbeat unsuspecting youths with man-made religion.

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